San Bernardino shootings

[dedanna1029]

Feel free to move to Pols & Relgs if you want. I'm looking for general discussion on this, not necessarily to verify anything or not.

I was raised not far from where the shootings happened, in Pasadena, California, USA. This does not come as a surprise to me really, being in the most violent country in the world from the top down. The gun control question is always the first thing to come up in things like this. I am not going to debate its merits or none.

When I was growing up back in the 70s there, my stepfather was one of the most highly commendated deputies in the LA Sheriff's Department. At the time, he worked the South-Central LA area, meaning he worked Watts, among others. The gangs even then were horrible. We never knew (and I mean this seriously) if he was going to come home that night or not.

At the same time, my mother was a high school teacher in the area. I was an incorrigible teen so Mum decided to take me to school with her one day and get an education on where I was headed. It was almost time for grades to come out, and these "kids," 15 to 17 year olds (who shoot regularly to make a buck) were asking if they were going to get As or whatever for the class. My mum just responded with, "If you did the work, you'll get the grade." One girl hauled off and told my mum, "I sure hope you gave me at least a " C" because I'd sho' like to see you go home tonight." My mum just said that the answer was already given, and then proceeded to ignore the girl. Needless to say, we did go home that night, but not because of any grade given or not. It was because my mum had stood up to these kids and told them how the cow ate the cabbage without fear.

My point is, things have not got better since for areas like the one I was raised in, in fact, things are much worse now (and make no mistake, mass shootings happened in those days as well, just not like now), regardless of the presence of guns or none.

We are indeed a very violent society in general in the states, from the top down. The government is extremely violent, even commits genocide, yet they expect the people not to be violent. I say it doesn't work that way. If the government were striving for peace, then the people would too. It takes a level of consciousness far above the one we have to get - and maintain - a peaceful nation. I myself am a peace loving chick, but will raise whatever hell I have to in order to get peace. I just refuse, even with my status as an anarchist, to do it violently. I do not want to emulate this government in any way.

A couple of stats: as of the time of the San Bernardino shootings, there had been 355 mass shootings in the states for the year 2015. Stat #2: That week, there were four mass shootings. In countries such as Australia and the UK, incidences like this are much lower. I have to ask however, was it honestly the banning of guns that did it, or was it a conscious shift in thought? If so, then which preceded the other?

All I know, is I myself have not become desensitised to these things. I am still very sad every time. The police in San Bernardino and the press both have hesitated to label the shootings as "terrorism." I guess it's only "terrorism" if a Muslim did it. I have to ask, if terror isn't what those people went through on that day, then what was it?

Discuss, but please keep in mind that my last job was "Caregiver for the developmentally disabled," so please try (even if you can't actually do it) to be a wee bit sensitive. This has hit home in more ways than one. Excuse the pun. Thanks.

[R_Head]

Another Sandy Hook and a vehicle to poke at the Gun Control crap-ola again. By the way, firearms sales spiked.

With all shit that is happening around the world the Gov does not want a population armed and against tyrants.

Do not forget Plan Parenthood in Colorado Springs.

Good timing I must say.

[dedanna1029]

That's one of the other four shootings I was talking about, was Colorado Springs.

I also think that the government does not want the violence level to come down, or they would do something real about this. However, it's free depopulation for them. The problem is too, they would have to start with their own greedy asses, and that they will not do.

It would be nice if the government were serious and banned guns and bombs and knives and the like from themselves, then we maybe could move forward with a peaceful influence and not a violent one. But, oh no, that would be Utopia and we cannae have that! <sarcasm>

Unfortunately sh!t rolls downhill. It would have to start at the top. We have over 3B people in the U.S., we could make them ban them from themselves if we just would get up off our complacent arses.

[viking60]

Correction: Shit floats to the top

I have said it before; what ever happened to throwing a vase at people you are PO at?

If it is too easy to grab a gun it will get dangerous.

I mean Obama himself would be dead if there was a gun available here:

[R_Head]

The Second Amendment, as passed by the House and Senate and later ratified by the States, reads:

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

The hand-written copy of the Bill of Rights which hangs in the National Archives had slightly different capitalization and punctuation inserted by William Lambert, the scribe who prepared it. This copy reads:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Both versions are commonly used by "official" U.S. government publications.

About 40,000 people get killed a year by motor vehicle accident. Ban all cars !!!!

Call me nut case but my thinking is on another place that not many people are looking.


Just to be clear... the 2nd amendment does not gives you a dam thing, does not give rights to weapons at all... read carefully. Is a Gov Constriction. You do not hear this often. These asses want to infringe it by weakening on what the people can have.

To me, this is the time for all of you living in the States to get one or move to a State that will ban them. Do not come knocking on my door to borrow one. I do not have anything to worry about but not going down before giving a fight.

The Fed Gov is getting ready for a home front and will go to great distances to achieve it

The mess is so huge the media cannot cover it all. The Fed Gov is afraid of its own people. If some bad happen, some like another Civil War it will go hell in a hand basket. The Feds is nobody if the States stop supporting them. Let us say the midwest wants to leave the Union. We have the Land, the Fuel and the Food the smoochers want. I bet they will put up a huge fight against it.

On that scenario... on which side of the fence you will be?

[viking60]

I can see your Spanish heritage there.
In Spain every Household wants to be a nation by itself

But dissolving unions is possible The Soviet Union does not exist anymore while the US union does.

I guess it is as simple as this:

What belongs together - grows together. ...And vice versa.

The use of firearms is not a necessity for that. Banning cars and firearms is to much but setting up some more red lights and traffic rules would be possible.

We all have off days where we do stupid things - on those days it would be good if no firearm was lying around... Throw a freaking vase instead.

And there is another thing:

Every idiot that swings a gun will probably be called a terrorist these days to justify surveillance.

[R_Head]

Every idiot that swings a gun will probably be called a terrorist these days to justify surveillance.

You just quoted a meme... if you have a military looking weapon and you are civilian, you must be terrorist. If not, a bigot, religious, republican, women-homophobic-off-the-meds-prepper-survivalist-nut-job. So that is the meme...

Can you imagine, the Feds printing money to no end, a fiat currency, the nation itself decide to stop playing. That money and the elite wealth, will go down the shit hole quicker than a hurry.

There are discrepancy to this event coming up. Such as... a rental vehicle with very dark tinted window that is illegal in the state the California. But who has Black SUVs with Dark Tinted Windows.... makes you go, hmmmmm......

[dedanna1029]

That really wasn't a meme. You were corrected on that in the Humor section by the Oxford Dictionary itself.

Clearly, neither one of you knows just how many shooting deaths there are in a second (or make that *maybe* 8 to 10 seconds) in the states. Go 'head, look them up. Go 'head, because I have over these many years that I've been alive since I was 14. You will find that our stats are so high, that even though they have fallen some since the mid-90s, they are still waaaaayyy above the norm comparatively.

Also, take the Second Amendment and shove it. Our Founding Fathers did NOT mean for a bunch of military wannabes to go out and make whole fields of storage buildings for guns, to include assault rifles (quite a few illegal ones) and military guns that no one in their right mind should own personally (you don't think people do that? Please do us all a favor and look that up too). They also meant it as a well-organised militia, appointed by the government. If they didn't, we wouldn't have laws against treason. Just because something says something doesn't mean that you can put it into a context to suit your own or my agenda.

Thomas Jefferson said as well that the constitution should be revisited with each generation, so it it well outdated. Don't bother quoting him or even discussing him unless you're willing to cop to that.

My point was and is, that we are indeed a very violent society, in good part because we are lead by and taught violence.

To state this more simply, I don't think for us to own guns as "the good guys" does jack anyway. We are outgunned for the most part by the military who have nukes and can kill everyone in the world just as fast as a gun can kill you. What are your lil' AK-47s going to do against them beans, eh?

A suicide bomber walks into a shop you're in with enough explosives to blow the whole damn block up unbeknownst to you and sets them off in the shop. Think that lil' pistol you got concealed is gonna get him?

Nope.

It's the violent society all around that needs to stop. A good start on that is to stop the wars and the shit that kills. Yes, people pull the trigger but they also buy the trigger to pull.

Let's be clear as well on something. This government is NOT afraid of its people. It already fires on them at will and continues to piss the people off at will. The government doesn't care about you or me. We are nothing but the little peon slaves.

[dedanna1029]

Violence begets violence begets violence begets violence. I don't care how you cut that mustard, it's true. If we want the governments to stop all these wars, we need to be willing to stop.

Oh, and ride 'em cowboy idiots Texas is holding a vote to secede from this here thing we call a "union" (which is in reality so fragmented it's pathetic). I wish them luck. Maybe they'll attempt a war with the U.S. with their gun totin' ideals.

It's OK honies, we'll just spank them a bit and send them home.

[R_Head]

War is not need it to secede. That is a misconception from the Civil War and warmongers. All is, the Republic of Texas can go on its marry way. What is wrong with that, just exercising the 10th Amendment.

In modern times... what if, Spain decides to leave the EU and be like it was before, a nation with its very own currency? Can they leave? Can they close the border? Here in the USA is just like that. People need to understand that State Law trumps Fed Law, not the other way around. The states are getting tired of the Fed Gov messing with them using Monetary Debt as a leverage.

K, if a bank forces you to do whatever they want, what you call that, extortion?

Honestly K, if you want to be with the others you can move to the North East States (Ivy Leagers); me, I stay right where I am at and defend my turf but not going out spoiling for a fight.

The 2nd amendment is a balance of powers between the Gov and the Population. If the Gov has all the firepower you will be living like Katniss's people from District 13.

You have not seen this in practice but you will appreciate it when the Storm Troopers comes in and push you guys around.

Of course I am exaggerating but the thought the population has claws terrifies the Fed Gov.

Forgot the name of the website, the one about gun related deaths. Even, a BB gun shot makes it there. Is so skewed and the number fudged that is not funny. Personally, do not know of anybody been shot. Do not ask me about Iraq (different story).

[dedanna1029]

I didn't say war was necessary to secede. I said Texas would probably (meaning at some point) declare war on the U.S. with it's gun totin' ideals. I also said if they did declare war we'd just spank them a bit and send them back home (to their country is what I was saying there).

It probably will. That's the attitude they have. War is democratic, doncha no. GWB said so.

If they want to secede that's fine with me. I say good riddance to the idiots there. Just one thing about it though. Once gone, they best make sure they're gone not to return. I don't want them back. They're an evil foreigner, unlike others, and don't deserve U.S. funds.

Let the 1700s hangings there begin once again for bar fight b.s. - just don't do it here.

[R_Head]

If you read history carefully, Texas was hijacked from Mexico and the rest of the west stolen with a stupid excuse. So the rest of Spain's possessions with a made up Spanish-US War... sinking the USS Main my foot.

Texas and all states have the right to leave. South Carolina tried because the North Eastern states imposed a screwed up set of Tariffs to pay for the 1812 War. The excuse was to prop up the North States manufacture and compensate for their losses. They tried to kick the Feds out of the state; all hell broke loose after. The rest is academia.

Lived in Texas for years and they are no different from you and I. They are just a proud state that can make money and the largest one of the 48 Continental states. So is a big dent for the money sucking socialistic idealist of the North Eastern state. Most politicians, graduate from the Ivy League colleges and you wonder why we are in such mess....

Is common from the Southeners to say "The South Will Raise Again". For the knowledgeable means, that if they keep up with the current economy policies a break up could happen. You are seen the economical debacle that is happening, wobbling like a top, loosing its energy.